Podcast: Has the number of data privacy cybersecurity incidents risen during this crisis?


Has the number of data privacy cybersecurity incidents risen during this crisis? Has the response changed? Tune into this episode of Incidentally to hear from John Merchant with Optio Insurance Services, breach counselor John Mullen with Mullen Coughlin, and COO of CyberClan Kadir Levent as they discuss how things are changing and what your company needs to consider in this time as companies potentially become more vulnerable to attacks.

Transcript

Automated:
Welcome to the brand new podcast by CyberClan. Incidentally, we know a lot of experts in the cyber security space and we know that there needs to be a lot more education across the industry. We endeavor each episode to bring you different aspects of the cyber security industry, whether it’s insurance, breach coaching, incident response, and much, much more. Let’s dive in.

Erin:
Welcome back everybody to Incidentally by CyberClan, the podcast. We just came to you last week with an episode with John Merchant. Thank you so much for being here again with Optio Insurance Services. This week, you’ve brought us one new guest and we also have a returning guest. I’m super excited to talk today about what actually happens once we come up upon an incident. So, we talked about data privacy and the world of COVID last week. Now we’re talking about what actually gets put into action when an incident happens in data privacy. So John, if you wouldn’t mind taking it away and introducing our guests for today, I would love that and then I’ll jump in with questioning later.

John Merchant:
Thank you very much Erin. Appreciate it. And John, Kadir, welcome. John, welcome back and Kadir welcome to Episode Two. Again, my name is John Merchant with Optio Insurance Services. Joining you today from a very dingy, somewhat industrial looking basement that definitely needs to be finished. That’s your work from home for you. So, I’d like to introduce my two guests. I’ll start with John Mullen. John is a founding partner of Mullen Coughlin. A Law firm with over 50 attorneys dedicated solely to representing organizations facing data privacy and information security incidents.

John Merchant:
And joining us from the UK, I guess which would be about seven thirty, quarter of eight, his time, is Kadir Levent. Kadir is the Chief Operating Officer of CyberClan, a global cyber security firm providing incident response services, vulnerability and pen testing, consulting, a host of all kinds of different cyber security related services. So thank both of you very much for joining today. And I do have a couple of questions quickly for the two of you before going back to Erin. So John, you first. Being an attorney, but my question would be, what is your favorites law firms show and is it remotely close to the reality of actually being a lawyer?

John Mullen:
I would say going back a long way would be LA Law, back in the day, right? So, that’s one of the ones that motivated me to get involved in the law world. So the answer of course is, it has nothing to do or it looks nothing like actual law firms. Everybody’s pretty in that show. Everybody’s well dressed, et cetera, et cetera. You’re always in court and none of that really happens in the real world. None of us are pretty, none of us are well dressed and you’re in court infrequently. It’s a little bit different.

John Merchant:
You’re a handsome man, John. So, give yourself some credit. Okay. LA Law, LA Law. All right, so Kadir, we were talking before the podcast started about your past in the London Metro Police. So very quickly, I know you can’t talk about a lot of things you did, but did you ever slap the cuffs on anyone? And if you did, were they the steel type or those zippy ones that you see on TV now? I’m just curious.

Kadir Levent:
Well, lucky for me that that wasn’t my role. I didn’t have to do that. So I had the meatheads (i meant “the muscles!” – no offense intended) that would go in first. They’d go through the door, they’d put everyone in cuffs and throw them to the ground and then I’d just tiptoe over there, usually over them and then pick up their computers. So, I had the fun part. I got to laugh in everybody’s face whilst they were struggling.

John Merchant:
Okay, all right. So Erin, back to you and we’ll get into it.

Erin:
I keep saying every time we record, that I’d rather us just have this little TV show going on for our podcast listeners. You can’t see it but we can see each other and it is a little bit like a comedy show we’ve got going on here. So thanks for bringing the humor, John. LA Law, for sure. Love that reference. And Kadir, I got to admit, I’m a little disappointed. I would have liked to have heard a story of slapping on the steel cuffs. The zip wire ones these days just don’t really seem to make a lot of sense to me.

Kadir Levent:
Remind me to tell you the story about the search that we did in somebody’s house once. And we searched both the bedside drawers on each side of the bed. Oh yeah, that was a fun one.

Erin:
You found the handcuffs there? Well, let’s jump into our topic for today. Again, last week we were talking a little bit about data privacy in a COVID world and this is obviously something that everyone’s talking about right now. But we’re really curious to see whether you all have seen in your businesses an increase in attacks and breaches since the pandemic began.

Kadir Levent:
We’ve definitely seen an incline in the amount of response calls that are coming in. So, I think the increase in remote working, just the fact that infrastructure’s last minute in most businesses, are just being coupled together to give remote access. I think security’s become number two instead of number one. And then what we’ve seen is, we’ve seen attackers, hackers, whatever you want to call them nowadays but those guys are definitely exploiting that. And you would have seen it in Local News or National News about these different campaigns and these threat actors that are targeting specific types of organizations. We’ve seen even healthcare entities during this pandemic where people are relying on healthcare systems to keep them alive. Unfortunately, those guys are being targeted, as well. So I mean, we’re definitely seeing an increase and we’re trying to increase our capacity to be able to deal with these responses. John, what have you seen?

John Mullen:
We are seeing an increase. So the short answer is, yes. The longer version is, I think there’s a couple of factors to consider and you hit on several of those. For one, obviously when people work remotely, there are more things in the network that are happening and more stresses on the network. And so therefore, more ability for the bad guys to get involved. The bad guys are not taking a break. They are not home, they are not sheltering in place or if they are, it’s not impacting their ability to be bad guys. So, that’s one thing we can tell for sure. I’d say our numbers are up in the last six weeks on average, maybe about 20%. Now having said that, I actually think they’re going to go up further. And here’s why. Certainly if you consider the small and middle market, right? So, you’re talking about companies that are not a 100 million or more, 200 million or more.

John Mullen:
But the smaller companies, the mom and pop shops, the places with three retail outlets, three different little local restaurants, local CPA and law firms, title agents, all those kinds of people. Those people, a lot of them are home and they’re not working. As we’ve seen in the United States, I think it’s like 30 million filings for unemployment. Well, a fair amount of those people are companies that aren’t able to work remotely because of the nature of the company that they are. And so, what does that mean? It means that … Pretend there’s a number. If there were 160 million people employed and we lost 30 million of those jobs, now you’re looking at a solid 20% of those folks not working any longer. So what does that mean? It means the companies are shut down to the point where their computers are off. Or they’re not being maintained and they’re not being watched nearly as closely.

John Mullen:
So, we’re now seeing the beginnings in the United States of a reopening. However you feel about that from a safety and political point of view, I think the reality will be that when those folks get back into those companies … Picture a theater. Theater is not working remotely, they’re just shut down. Now when they go back and they turn on their computer, what’s going to happen? And the patches that weren’t applied for the last six weeks, that were still being put out by all the software companies and those are in place, what’s going to happen? So, I think on top of more stress on the system because of the remote nature of some of the work or most of the work, you’re also going to see an uptick even beyond what we’ve seen when a lot of those smaller companies, who frankly, have less IT support and expertise, just by the nature of the beast and the budget, I think you’re going to see further uptick.

John Merchant:
I can add quickly, anecdotally, being at my in laws for the last six weeks because a tiny apartment in Brooklyn’s not the place to be right now. I have become the defacto family IT guy in security and my mother-in-law came to me three separate times today to ask me if there is an email that she should have answered. All three were a clear, no. One was from the World Health Organization. Another one was from a very poorly written a subject line that I think had a Gmail tag in it.

John Merchant:
And another one, I believe was from DHS. All were clearly preying on and this was within her network at the company she works at. So, I’m seeing an increase frequency and it just … Personally, I can tell you that our company, we’ve received definitely an increase in the amount of phishing and email scams prior to the pandemic. We didn’t see nearly as many. Now that could be obviously a function of being more aware of them or there was an increase. I think it’s the latter though. I’m just empirically seeing a significant increase in the amount phishing attempts that are coming in the door.

John Mullen:
That observations interesting for one other reason. If the level of your IT support is that John Merchant is now your expert and if that’s playing out across the country, I think that we are going to see a whole lot more problems.

John Merchant:
Thank you John. Thank you very much.

Erin:
Then you definitely don’t want to know who my IT support is. I’ve been letting people just come into my computer to tell me what the heck’s going on. Also, I think the next question that just raises is, okay, maybe we’re all seeing more incidents. But the way in which they’re unfolding and how you all are dealing with them, is that changing as a result of the pandemic or is that business as usual?

John Mullen:
I would say it’s changing somewhat. A couple different things. For one, as John indicated a few moments ago, there are more and trickier ways that people are being attacked in terms of phishing exploits. Getting notices about COVID or remote safety and processing and people thinking creatively. Bad guys thinking creatively about how they’re going to attack people and send them things that are just so tempting to open it because they seem legitimate, health oriented, survey oriented, all those kinds of things, right? So, I think we’re going to see lots of that kind and we already are. So, that’s just how they’re initiating the attacks. Another issue we’re seeing is because of the remote nature of the beast, it’s not always easy to for the Kadir’s of the world, and he’s going to chime in, in a moment I’m sure, for them to do what they normally do.

John Mullen:
For instance, what if you have to put boots on the ground and send somebody into the companies who maybe don’t have a sophisticated IT department? How do you do that? If people can’t get on planes, you can’t get on trains, et cetera, and they’re not local. What if somebody’s not in a major metropolitan area? So that’s sort of one. What happens, and we see this more often, although the folks like Kadir and his team can work remotely in a vast majority of the cases because what they’d have is, they have competent or relatively competent IT people at the client site and with guidance there said, “Well copy this and hit that switch and turn that logging audit,” those kinds of concepts. But what if the people aren’t there and they also are remote? And they say, “Well, I could do some of this from my terminal here in my basement, but I can’t do some of it.” So, now what?

John Mullen:
So, now they’re unable to go and do the beginnings of the remediation work so that Kadir and his team can get in there and really go at it and figure out what happened and get them safe and all the things one has to do, but they’re not physically there. What do you do? So, those are some of the things that we’re seeing that are causing delays. In one case at least we’ve seen where, we never could get because it was remote. We never could get the appropriate help on the forensic side into the building. And that company ended up working with one of the forensic vendors, much like Kadir. But they had to send in a bunch of engineers, not computer people, engineers who had to take days upon days of Zoom calls and things like that, to just hit that button, now put your hand over there. And really rudimentary level stuff that just delayed a response and a rebuild pretty notably.

Kadir Levent:
Yeah. And it’s exactly that. That’s definitely what we’re facing and what we’re experiencing in is. And there’s a balance between … I think one of the things that we touched on first actually and I’ll mentioned that is, you spoke about unemployment rates and here in the UK there’s a lot of staff being furloughed so they’re being effectively paused from work. Now, one particular instance in that we’re dealing with at the moment, their IT team, originally was 15 strong. They’ve let go of most of their staff, they have two people left in IT. So, the challenges are, right, you’re facing now a ransomware incident. We can’t come to your premises, you’re not on your premises, you guys were working remotely. So exactly that. How are we going to get you in a position where we can preserve the artifacts that we need to preserve because they’re in an education space.

Kadir Levent:
So, there could be possible legal consequences if we don’t conduct a file investigation. And secondly, how are we going to get your systems back up online? That’s the second thing. So, like you say, “There’s two major elements here.” And I think what I’m seeing in the insurance background … I’m sure John will mention, as well, from multi perspectives. But one of the biggest issues that we face is trying to get systems back up online. Investigation is one thing but if there’s no one in the building to either let us in remotely, let us in physically … Like you say, “Transport systems aren’t running like they used to. You can’t just catch the next flight and go to the next place. It doesn’t work like that at the moment.” And because of that, we’re seeing a significant increase to the actual business interruption.

Kadir Levent:
So the resumption side, is taking us much longer than it would. A typical ransomware investigation may take between two and four weeks. So, we’re now seeing it might take between four and eight weeks depending on what the capabilities are like. So, lucky for us, we were built to work remotely. So we have technologies in place, we have people all over the country, left, right and center, ready to be deployed, ready to assist both remotely or boots on the ground. But there are lots of businesses out there like you say, “But the doors are shut, nobody’s coming in.” So yeah, definitely challenging times and we’re doing everything we can as an organization. But like you say, “There’s a lot of victims out there that haven’t come forward yet.” And that’s going to be interesting over the next month or so, to see what that looks like.

John Mullen:
Yeah. Another thing, just play Kadir’s example out a little bit. They had 15 IT staff at that company he’s talking about, they knocked it down to two. Well who’s to say the two are senior? They might be junior, right? And younger people who have almost no institutional knowledge. So, one would think, right? If you kept the two top people and Kadir’s guys are asking questions, they can say, “Yeah, we did that and we instituted that six months ago and we had that in place. Well, we chose not to do that but we did this instead.” Those educated, knowledgeable responses. You get two newbies who are left because they’re cheap and they’re looking at with a blank stare at these guys saying, “We don’t know, we can check.” So that’s yet another complication I think we’re seeing.

Kadir Levent:
And that is exactly what we’re facing with this particular case. The two guys that are left … And I don’t know whether it was on purpose, they were left there because they were the cheapest but they were definitely not senior. And you’d be asking them questions about, “Hey, I need to know what this is. What does this mean in your infrastructure?” And they’re like, “Hey, you know what, that was here before my time.” And you’re like, “Okay.” So basically, nobody knows. So now, we’re chasing this ghost, which potentially nobody knows about. So yeah, challenging, interesting. I’m going to be really interested to see how this impact in insurance market in terms of the level of the claims and the business interruption claims because I think that’s going to hurt, I think.

John Merchant:
Slightly a bit of a tangent here but I often get questions about how we underwrite this risk, how we price this risk. One thing, a big thing that comes into consideration is how many cyber security staff do you have and how much money do you spend on it? So at the point of binding, that company had 15 people on staff. However midterm, and obviously I don’t know if this is our insured or not, but theoretically midterm, they now have two. So, the risk has changed significantly and there’s no way that we could have accounted for that, even in our wildest dreams thinking that this thing would have happened. So, it’s just interesting to hear from that side. And then again, for those of you wondering how we underwrite this risk, that is a factor that we take into consideration and we’ll probably take into even broader consideration going forward. If something like this happens again, God forbid, wave two, wave three, over the years, it’s something that we need to think about.

Erin:
John Merchant, you bring up a really interesting point. Is how are our companies even thinking to call their insurance carriers and their underwriters to say, “Hey, just want to give you a heads up. We’ve now reduced our count.” Obviously no one wants to pay more on a premium but at the same time you don’t want to get caught flat footed. And I would assume, we talked a little bit about regulations and regulatory environments last week. But given that everything’s changing, how have you all seen in the industry that that’s being taken into account? That someone may not be calling their carrier to say, “We’ve reduced our staff.” Which then changes the risk profile and then it’s taking three more weeks to get online. And so, now the cost of business interruptions higher. It just sounds like a knock on effect in all three of your worlds, that is greatly impacted.

John Merchant:
My sense of that would be they’re not telling their carriers and they don’t feel they need to. That no one’s asking for an interim report unless they do. I’d be shocked to hear that they’re so diligent and so conscientious, that they’re telling on themselves.

John Mullen:
That’s true. They there is no requirement for a company. And honestly, if they’ve just let off 13 of 15 employees, the last thing they’re thinking of is, “I’m going to call my insurance carrier and let them know.” There are services that are accessible throughout the life cycle of one of these policies and Optio’s policies are sent under writing’s policies, all provide for loss prevention services, hotlines, access to CyberClan, one hour consultations. In the event something as this were to happen, they can reach out and ask for advice. Mullen Coughlin would do the same thing. They would provide them advice if they wanted it. It’s just a matter of how do you get that message through what could be six or seven iterations. The telephone game to the insurer to let them know that they can call this number and access these services. So, it’d be great if they did, but I just don’t think at this point that’s a reality.

Kadir Levent:
So John Mullen, I’ve got a question for you actually. Here we go. So we’re dealing with quite a few cases where there’s data privacy concerns and there’ll be legal obligations for notification, et cetera, et cetera. So obviously there’s deadlines around those, right?

John Mullen:
Right.

Kadir Levent:
So, in your experience at the moment with the way things are going, can you see Attorney Generals or whoever it might be from a regulatory perspective, being a little bit more lenient on notification deadlines or whatever that might look like?

John Mullen:
So, the answer is, and this is a human nature response, right? The answer is yeah, I do believe that if necessary and if pertinent and accurate to one given claim, that the regulators by and large are reasonable people and that they will understand when we tell them, “Here’s the way this played out and here were the facts.” And as long as you can back it up, by and large, I believe they will be reasonable in their enforcement. And frankly, most of them are already reasonable in their enforcement. Not plaintiff’s attorneys. So, as an example, the State Regulators in the United States, there’s probably a half a dozen who are very active and another half a dozen somewhat active, in terms of enforcing pretty routinely, their statutes. I would say very, very rarely are any of them unreasonable.

John Mullen:
And the few quirky requests that we’ve gotten over the last year or two have almost always been resolved by picking up the phone and saying, “I know you asked for this but would this do instead? And here’s why I’m offering.” And almost always they say, “Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I get it. Okay, yeah, that’s cool. Give us that.” And it’s not been a real problem for us. The Feds, depending on the industry you’re in, can be a little bit tougher and are certainly more likely to hit you with a larger fine. But even there, philosophically, my opinion … And we’ve got a dozen plus X district attorneys and AG’S working at the firm, so they have a good sense of these people. Regulators are going to pick on people who they deem to be not serious about data privacy.

John Mullen:
So as long as you can show regulators that you took it seriously before it happened, that you did your best and promptly when it did happen and you followed up and made even more alterations since it happened. If you could tell that story, then you’re generally not in the hotspot. Now, that’s all going to change if you lose millions of records, right? I mean if you lose 1 million, 2 million, 10 million records, then you’re going to be in the hotspot no matter what. But it still helps to be civil and cooperative as opposed to quarrel with some of these folks.

Kadir Levent:
Yeah. And that’s really, really interesting. So, we’re working on a few cases now where there are standard notification deadlines. And again, from the earlier challenges that we spoke about, no fault of our own, everything unfortunately gets taken longer than it usually would, because we don’t have the same access that we usually would. Even from our perspective, we have a laboratory that we’ll work from, we have a lab. So, our guys can’t even work from the forensics labs in the same capacity that they usually would. So unfortunately, and I know everybody’s experiencing the same things that everybody’s experiencing these delays. But it’s interesting to see your take on that.

Kadir Levent:
And I think what worries me is, going back to just some of the examples that we’ve had about access to systems, access to preservation of forensics data, being able to successfully take that. It’s going to be interesting to see how the industry responds to that, i.e., our forensic investigations being hindered by limited access. Meaning, when it comes to being able to defend yourself against the possible litigation, it might be that the investigation couldn’t be as comprehensive as what it could have been six months ago just because of the way things are going. So I think it’s definitely interesting times and I would hope that from a litigation perspective, from Attorney General’s and notification deadlines, like you say, “It’s good to hear that from your experience there, there is a bit of lenience there.”

John Mullen:
Yeah. And to be clear, I was talking about regulators who I find to be, by and large, reasonable people. I am not talking about the plaintiff’s bar. I think ultimately, they could care less. They are going to bring these same lawsuits if not more. They’re going to be as aggressive as ever. Certainly in the United States, plaintiff’s attorneys get paid, not by the hour, they get paid by the result. So, they are highly motivated to bring cases and to try to win and/or settle them. And they will use whatever leverage this environment creates for them. I do not think you get a break on that.

Erin:
I mean I certainly am now a little bit concerned. And I will be calling Kadir from now on for my IT support. Thank you very much John Merchant. And this has me thinking a lot about across the sector in each of the areas, whether you’re acting as the breach counselor or you’re acting in the incident response or you’re really in the hot seat with the insurance coverage because that seems like the most volatile thing that ends up actually having to pay out the money and recoup the costs of whatever has happened, that this is changing everyone’s world upside down. How often are you guys actually getting a chance to check check your breath here and talk to each other to see what things you need to be changing for the future?

John Merchant:
Yeah. I can jump in being at the insurance portion of things in the … Yes, we foot the bill but that’s what insurance is for. Honestly, that it is to … We’re set up to pay claims, we’ve got to make sure that these companies, to Kadir’s point from earlier in the podcast, to make sure these companies get back up and running as quickly as possible. It is in no one’s best interest to have a company be out for a tremendous amount of time. And then, we as the insurance carrier end up paying out a significant claim. And also more importantly, honestly, that company could end up going out of business if they’re out long enough. And that reduces your exposure base. And then you have less buyers, you have less companies, you have more people out of work. That’s not good for anybody. So, at a very high level, it’s part of our social contract to make sure we’re there to ensure these companies can continue to be up and running and employ people and grow and just do well and contribute to the economy. So, that’s it for my side. John?

John Mullen:
Yeah. I mean, it’s funny if the question is, how much are we all having a chance to circle to each other, other than by phone calls? One fun example is, John and I are in a small group outside of Philadelphia. Every Thursday we pull up our cars and our trucks and sit in a big circle with our beach chairs and talk to each other. And maybe we have a beer, maybe we don’t. And there’s two brokers in that group. There’s two underwriters in that group. There’s a lawyer and there’s another service provider and we’re probably adding some more. So, that’s one way the industry’s still getting together with each other. And I happen to know, I told that story to some of my friends up in the Connecticut region and they’re about to start doing the same thing. So, the industry will survive and is talking to each other.

Erin:
Wondering if I can go ahead and drive from DC and just meet you guys there? And then maybe I’ll just bring the mic’s and we’ll just record that.

Kadir Levent:
We’ll need to get them on the iPad in the corner of the trunk. Yeah, so John-

Erin:
We can bring you in, too. Yes.

John Merchant:
Bring me in.

Kadir Levent:
But now definitely, I’d second that, as well. So, we’re doing the same thing. We’re just trying to make as many touch points with our friends, with our colleagues, as possible. And at the end of the day, like we said earlier as well, everybody is experiencing the same thing right now. And it really is a National Crisis and International Crisis, a Global Crisis. So I have friends in Australia, I have friends in the US, in Canada, in the middle East. And everybody that I speak to and I’m making a conscious effort just to try and contact people that much more. Just to check in with everyone and see what the temperature is, see how everybody’s doing. And everybody’s saying the same thing.

Kadir Levent:
Everybody’s going through the same crisis. So, in a way it’s quite refreshing. And I think, me personally, I’ve taken this time to really reflect on the things that are important but I think it’s also made me appreciate when that client calls up and they’ve had that problem or they’re facing an incident, and like John said earlier, “The longer that they’re out, that website’s down, which is what they’re purely relying on for their income at the moment. Or their shop shut and they were doing takeaways and now they can’t because their point of sale system doesn’t work anymore.” That’s someone’s livelihood. That’s someone keeping food on the table for their family. And I think it really puts that personal side into things. So definitely, it’s a challenging times. But we do, I think as a community, especially in the cyberspace, I think everybody is still talking to each other, which is great.

John Mullen:
And the last point there is the cyber community, although it is a multi billion dollar entity, as you know taken as a whole, is still not particularly large in terms of numbers of individuals. I mean you can take a couple hundred people, put them in a room and that’s it. That’s pretty much the whole cyber history at any real level. So, most of us do know each other or have friends who work with each other, et cetera. So we all benefit from it being a fairly tight knit community.

Erin:
Well I am glad to be on the periphery of the community and getting to know all of you guys and learn more about your business. And you know, I just have to say John Merchant, I mean, we got the LA Law story. Kadir, what’s your favorite police drama and how close is it? Please say, “NYPD Blue,” but go ahead and say your own.

Kadir Levent:
What’s that one on TV with a cyber … Is it CSI?

Erin:
CSI, yeah. Oh, yeah. I didn’t even realize there was a cyber version of it, but-

Kadir Levent:
Yeah. Watch that, there you go. Because everything you see on that show, it’s not real.

Erin:
Yeah. I just was hoping you were going to tell me you were the Sipowicz, too. What was the other guy on NYPD Blue?

Kadir Levent:
That’s not me.

John Mullen:
Andy Sipowicz. [inaudible 00:29:11].

Erin:
I remember such a good show. Kadir, I actually have to say, I think you’re probably too young for that show but-

Kadir Levent:
What is that?

John Mullen:
NYPD Blue’s [inaudible 00:29:18].

Erin:
It’s the best, the best. Remember when Rick Schroeder came in? I mean, we all were like, what? Where did Ricky come from? Anyway. Well, I can’t wait for us to uncover the next topic and bring you guys back again. This is always such a fun part for me and I’ll just give the last few seconds here of airtime for any of you that have any closing thoughts for us on talking about data privacy and incident response in a time of COVID. Go for it.

Kadir Levent:
Yeah. I think something that John Merchant mentioned earlier. At the end of the day, we are all here to help in one way, shape or form. So, if anybody’s listening to this podcast and they think, “Hey, I’ve had to implement a last minute work from home and I don’t know what my security posture looks like.” Honestly, just give us a call. It’s not about the money, there’s no cost involved. We can just have a chat with you, talk about what it looks like, what you’ve had to do last minute. See how we can help you to make sure that you are secure and if that helps you get through the next few months then we’ve done what we need to do.

John Mullen:
Yeah. I’ll jump in here. And I’ve said this before, but I do believe it. Certainly if you are an employee or a company that you’re not largely working from home and/or shut down, when you reopen and you realize that the cyber risk is real for you and you haven’t really been looking at it before, understand that the insurance industry really has figured it out. We’re not perfect, the industry isn’t perfect, but there is a response plan. There is a way to recover from these things in an orderly fashion with the right experts. You just have to avail yourself of that information by talking to guys like John Merchant and his team.

John Merchant:
I can’t top either of those, so I will just hand it back over to Erin. I mean, it’s the reason why we bring people like John Mullen and Kadir Levent on board to do these things and to educate. So Erin, it’s all yours.

Erin:
Absolutely. Well thank you all gentlemen for being here. I again, I think it’s really helpful, Kadir to your point also, just for people to hear this. If you don’t already have a security posture in place that’s robust, make sure you’re checking on that. If you don’t already have cyber security insurance policies, make sure this is the time now to realize this is a real risk and it’s a risk bigger than most of us know. And the risk may be lying in how easily it is to fix right now based on what everyone’s suffering and going through. So, thank you guys for actually elucidating that point, that this isn’t just about being more vulnerable, it’s also about the fact that this is impacting cybersecurity professionals in the same way that it’s impacting your business. And therefore, this may in fact take longer than you expect and it’s the right time to be thinking about it. So, we really appreciate your expertise guys and your humor. Of course, your personalities, it’s what really shines through actually. So, thank you so much for being with us today and we look forward to our next episode. Take care.

John Merchant:
Thank you.

John Mullen:
Thank you.

Automated:
That’s it for today’s episode of incidentally brought to you by CyberClan. Check us out at www.cyberclan.com

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